Brand Name Loyalty???

The Prophet · 04-03-2010

Is there such a thing as Brand name loyalty any more?

I think Harley Davidson certainly does an outstanding job of promoting events, and selling so much labeled merchandise you can't turn around anymore without seeing a HD shirt or jacket. Many a Harley has been sold as a result of events, marketing, and the whole "Lifestyle" approach, which seems to cater to and attract more women than men from a 'fashion' angle, but maybe the 'women' are the decision makers in those cases. She would look ridiculous in a skull pattern doo-rag and fringed leather chaps if arriving on a CBR or a BMW Tourer!!

But what of the other brands? When the last time you saw a "Yamaha" event? Have you seen a "Ducati" T-shirt lately? Seems like this push towards customer loyalty and repeat purchasing is not looming large on anyone else's agenda.

Triumph at least sells some apparel and trinkets, and my Dealer - for one - organises events for customers at least about every quarter. I suggest that maybe there is no real connection anymore between customer and brand name, as Superbike and MotoGP racing is so far out of the reach and lifestyle of the "average Joe". How does one relate? Moto-racing is much bigger in Europe, so maybe there is a connection over there, but not here in the States.

Me? I had a Triumph "back in the day" (1970) then wandered around from brand to brand in the 80's and 90's, mostly a range of Japanese offers, until deciding to try Triumph again in '07, mostly because the 'new un's" looked remarkably like the "old un's", and I had foggy memories of the past.

There ARE a few old Triumph guys around, but not too many. Mostly there are new riders who have a strange and bizzare (read embarrassing) idea about what "bikers" are supposed to be. Those of us who were actually alive and riding back in the late 60's / early '70's remember it very differently. Bikers were just regular guys back then, and we always helped each other out. Another very clear memory is that we NEVER badmouthed a guy because of what he rode, what model it was, or what - if any - accessories or add-ons he had. We were happy just to have a set of wheels, and good folks to ride with. I see a lot of squids now-a-days that talk about nothing other than how wealthy they are, and how much they spend on their rides. Who gives a flying sh**? Please take up another hobby guys! How about golf? Or knitting?

I can't complain about the new Triumph, as the bike has been 100% faultless, but would I buy another merely because of the Triumph name?

No.

Are you brand specific? Married to a particular make and model? If so, why?

If not... why not? What's the story behind your bike choice? Any brand you would NEVER consider? Why?

Ride safe!

Bob

Jamie · 04-03-2010

"La Bird" is my fifth Hinckley Triumph in recent years. Reasons:

Three of the four previous ones (Daytona 955i, Daytona 675, Street Triple 675) have been both extremely enjoyable and totally devoid of trouble. The fourth one (Rocket III of Oct. '04) was a bit...er... temperamental, granted. But I kept it for 4 1/2 years (the two 675 were my "other" bikes), longer than any other bike I have ever owned.
I do relate to the "old" brand image (however dented, given product obsolescence issues and Meriden's eventual agony) as I started riding in the late 60's (sigh)
But I relate even more positively to the "current" brand image: bikes with personality. I would be hard-pressed to define what I mean by personality ... but IMO the word hardly applies to the four Japanese brands.
I deeply admire private entrepreneurship, and Mr Bloor, Triumph's owner, deserves heaps of respect for resurrecting Triumph and making it an innovative (vs nostalgia-driven) success story.
Along the same line, I have, I confess, an undisguised "Back Britain!" bias (being born in Canada made me a virtual subject of HM's Commonwealth). And BTW, my cage is a BRG Jaguar (which predates the recent Indian takeover).
I have often found my Triumph dealer (and others in the area) to "try harder" than his local competitors (Harley, BMW and other shops) both to satisfy my needs AND to valiantly try to rock my soul.
I get to meet YOUNG (18-30) riders at my Triumph dealership, mostly due to the 675cc appeal. A mixture of candor, passion and product knowledge ( hey, otherwise they 'd all be riding Japanese mounts) . At Harley, BMW and Guzzi, I occasionally get the impression of having a premature face-to-face with my future retirement "home" companions
Conversely, at Ducati, MV and Aprilia, I increasingly feel I have only been granted a short leave of absence from that dreaded "home"

Sorry for over-responding. Best. Jamie

The Prophet · 04-04-2010

Is it possible to "over-respond" on this forum??

I couldn't agree more Jamie, on most of your points. Well played.

I too, cannot complain at all about my Hinckley Triumph. Actually, the engine was built at Hinckley, then all components shipped to Thailand from points afar for assembly. The build is flawless, and I've had zero issues, now going on 23,000 miles. My dealer also commented that the Thai-built bikes are very well assembled, and he see's fewer warranty issues with these bikes. You also have to admire Bloor for maintaining the "bottom line' by shifting manufacturing around to the best advantage. In retrospect, it appears that this strategic move played a major role in keeping Triumph solvent, while so many other brands are currently in deep financial trouble. Great strategic move.
I too ...somewhat relate to the old '60's era Triumph's, as I did actually have one back then. Wish I still did!
Your comment on "Personality" is well chosen, and well taken. "Character" is another attribute used. Difficult to explain, hard to achieve. Sort of like "cool" in a person. If one needs to ask what it is... he doesn't have it. And yes, I agree, for whatever reason the Japanese bikes have never been able to achieve the "personality", or "character" so sought after in bikes. I will say, however, that the old Honda Cubs I saw recently in Japan had some of this character. It perhaps can also be gained through "patina"?
I too enjoy supporting a true entrepeneur such as Mr. Bloor, especially one who displays a true enthusiam and love of the sport. I enjoy as well the fact that he barely used the "nostalgia" bit, as say "Indian" has, and HD lately with "Crossbones" and other odd offers. He did go slightly retro with the "Modern Classics" range, which I admit I fell for, but for the most part he offers modern, cutting edge technology rides for all age groups, and riding styles.
Since I am a typical American "mutt" (Half Irish heritage / half German heritage, neither overly strong or important to anyone), I have no leanings toward any nationalism, so I'll leave that out of my purchasing bias. Actually, "back-'n-the-day", as I recall no one mentioned any "British" lineage surroundiing the Triumph's, they were just great bikes. Same could be said about Norton's and BSA's, and Royal Enfields back then. Here in the States, they were just looked at as great bike's, not necessarily British. Japanese bikes, on the other hand, did have a strong arrow pointing them at a still considered somewhat evil Japan, and they also had the "Made in Japan" label, which at that time meant... junk. Obviously they overcame both prejudices admirably with time and hard work.
Plus +1000 on the Triumph Dealership remark. My dealer in southern Wisconsin is arguably the best, and they always makes my wife and I feel right at home. We do try to attend as many events as practical, and the amount of mutual trust is easily 100%. How many other brand dealers can that be said about? We have a local (huge) HD Dealership that you would need to beg the Sales-person to help you out, and they look down their tatooed noses at ya' if you say you're "just lookin'". "What kind of bike to you ride?" Oh, ... they still make those?" Gimme a break.
Right again about being able to meet a younger, more enthusiastic and eager crowd at the Triumph dealership or sponsored get togethers. At the events, there are always younger couples and singles, and it sometimes fun to see them act like nuts (if in good fun!), remembering that we all did the same stuff at that age. On the other hand, I personally don't care at all for the "leftover" HD wannabee's who seemingly buy Triumph's because maybe they couldn't afford a shiney new HD, or maybe some HD guys kicked sand in their face at some local beach. Anyway, acting like a stereotypical tool and wearing a full costume of "I'm supposed to be a badass" clothes, in some lame attempt to impress... someone(?), is embarrasing for us all. Please buy something else besides a Triumph, we have a totally different viewpoint on life guys!
All that said, I guess there IS some brand loyalty in my blood. My problem is: Triumph - in my HO, has yet to design and offer a true, "all-rounder" long range Touring Bike.

The Rocket III, is way too big (for me), and a little (!) over the top size-wise. Fantastic bike I'm sure, just a tad oversized for my taste.

The Thunderbird I love, but by the time you equip it with windshield, bags, comfy seat and backrest, rearward footpegs, and so on, the price gets too high for a Triumph (Vs, say BMW, Kawa Concours, etc.).

I'm talkin' about something to ride from Illinois to say the Grand Canyon, or Illinois to the Florida Gulf area, in reasonable comfort, and ease of back pain, etc. It is for that reason that I may (85% sure) step over the line to the "Dark Side" soon, as in late this season/early next. The wife is "out of commission" riding - wise (leg pains, physical therapy sessions, etc.), so the pressure is off for a big road bike for now, but I'm preparing for next year's season.

In closing, I have a strong feeling that Triumph is going to come out with a slightly altered model of the T-Bird for 2011 that will offer the "Touring" bits I mentioned in a "Package" deal that will bring it down to earth. We'll see.

Now THAT'S over-responding!

Ride safe!

Bob

motowebmaster · 04-04-2010

From a Ducati perspective, this pretty much says it all:

If one isn't in awe of the flowing italian spirit, there are plenty of ways any Ducati enthusiast can express themselves. Ducati clothing and accessories abound via both official and aftermarket suppliers.

Triumph's perspective was to focus on R.A.T. - which isn't necessarily a bad thing. I mean, there's no racing heritage or sexy models sponsored by John Bloor - so taking a ride is just about all one could do at an event. I enjoy some Triumph t-shirts, but since my fall from grace there hasn't been a desire to live within the heritage.

For most of the riding community, a H.O.G. Rally or major event like Daytona, BBB-BBQ, or Sturgis represents as much fun and good times as any one individual should have. Even if one doesn't own a Harley, almost anyone can find a branded clothing item they enjoy wearing. In the winter, I still wear a black sweater from a Maryland Dealer.

Honda's continued conservative approach to just about anything doesn't associate well to a lifestyle. I don't know how they could overcome this.

Brand Awareness diminishes beyond this point with other manufacturers, in my opinion.